Medeco took me down hard

[vector40]

Barry Wels is one of the foremost figures in lock security, and by all accounts, nicest guys around. I could not fathom him pulling a fast one for any imaginable reason.

Can you even master Medecos?

[n2oah]

I don't know who Barry Wels is. I'm sure he's an honorable guy, but I would still want to see it myself.

Barry Wels is a member of TOOOL (I think he might be the founder,too) who speaks all over the world at many security conventions(H2K, H2K2, WhattheHack) , he also co-invented Cryptophone and is a major crypto guy. Believe it or not, he's also a member of lockpicking101! I'm sure he had many witnesses when he picked T14 Biaxial (you can hear many people in the background of the video). I don't think he'd pull this kind of stunt.
Yes, you can masterkey Medeco locks, but I'm not 100% sure how it's done.

[raimundo]

It probably has a large format removable interchangeable core controlled by a key.

[yippeegollies]

Yes, you can master key Medeco locks. It is done in exactly the same way as conventional pin tumbler cylinders, by putting a third tumbler between the bottom pin and the top driver.

Yip

[vector40]

But how do you deal with the sidebar?

[cracksman]

I thought general regions would recieve certain sidebar configurations through Medeco, is this true? If so, how hard would it be to map this?

I'm still confused about the picking order in sidebar locks, I'm thinking more of dimple locks, but I would imagine all pin tumblers are similiar. Is there a generally practiced order of picking? (sorry, don't know if this is for the advanced froum or not)

I'm trying to make the leap from normal locks to high security and I find there is a wide area with little info

[n2oah]

I thought general regions would recieve certain sidebar configurations through Medeco, is this true? If so, how hard would it be to map this?

Maybe there is, but it's not likely. The lock you are thinking of is the Assa Twin, which has different sidebar codes for different regions.
Maybe if you had a lot of Medeco locks from various regions, or a lot of people participating, you could finally crack the dreaded Medeco. Or then again, you'll probably do loads and loads of reasearch and find nothing.

[TOWCH]

The patterns in the sidebars of Primus and ASSA twin are a result of their key control scheme. They distubute blanks and then the locks are pinned to them. Medeco blanks can be cut to the lock so there is no reason for a pattern to form.

[monkeE]

My college uses Medeco exclusively for any locks on campus (even for the cabinets). I have had access to quite a few keys in my time here, and have not seen any pattern in the pin rotations. The keyway is cut different for different areas of the university, so security is really impressive. I can vouch for the mastering of these keys, as I had access to some master keys. The pin rotations on those matched up to the pin rotations of the lower level keys, most of the time.
Hope that info helps someone out.
(P.S. Even the vending machines use Mededco here)
(P.P.S. Of course I didn't try to pick these, that would be illegal!)

[yippeegollies]

Medeco has different keyways for different regions, and some large institutions, (government, universities etc..) have their own private keway. Sidebars are all the same, only difference is the keyhole.

Yip

[n2oah]

Medeco has different keyways for different regions, and some large institutions, (government, universities etc..) have their own private keway. Sidebars are all the same, only difference is the keyhole.

Yip

So all of the rotations on the pins are the same on every lock?

[monkeE]

No, the keyway, ie the form factor looking "down the barrel" is the same. The rotations are different, but for the masters I saw at my university, the rotations of them and the slave keys were very similar.



Monkee

[n2oah]

No, the keyway, ie the form factor looking "down the barrel" is the same. The rotations are different, but for the masters I saw at my university, the rotations of them and the slave keys were very similar.

He said the sidebars were all the same, does he mean the shape of the sidebar or the sidebar code? I'm confused

[monkeE]

I said the keyway is the same. The sidebar (ie the thing that cares about pin rotation) was different for many pins of different locks, and even between master and slave of one lock.

Monkee

[n2oah]

I said the keyway is the same. The sidebar (ie the thing that cares about pin rotation) was different for many pins of different locks, and even between master and slave of one lock.

You said? I was talking about what Yip said. Noah is now confused even more.