Sargent & Greenleaf 8077AB Shackle Strength

[Code_Superfly]

Greetings! Everyone here seems to appreciate quality security, whether it's a computer system, lock, or anything else in our daily lives. Vulnerabilities are there to expose, and correct. It seems I'll be in good company here.

With that said, I have a brute-force related question regarding the Sargent & Greenleaf 8077AB combination lock. How resistant is the 8077's shackle to say, 36" bolt cutters? I'm asking because I recently picked up one of these beauties, and the shackle looks like it's only about 5/16". Being S&G, I would imagine the shackle's made of pretty good steel, but who knows. (For the record, I'm generally a feel the lock, finesse type of guy. What fun is it to totally bypass the puzzle, right?)

We know the 8077's extremely difficult to manipulate. We know they're obviously not vulnerable to picking, or shimming. The body of the lock itself is quite beefy I'd say, but the shackle continues to poke at my curiosity.

I like my $350-$400 lock just a little too much to attack it with bolt cutters haha. It's all polished up. Figure maybe someone else out there has tried bolt cutting one which didn't have a combo just for the hell of it.

[Squelchtone]

Greetings! Everyone here seems to appreciate quality security, whether it's a computer system, lock, or anything else in our daily lives. Vulnerabilities are there to expose, and correct. It seems I'll be in good company here.

With that said, I have a brute-force related question regarding the Sargent & Greenleaf 8077AB combination lock. How resistant is the 8077's shackle to say, 36" bolt cutters? I'm asking because I recently picked up one of these beauties, and the shackle looks like it's only about 5/16". Being S&G, I would imagine the shackle's made of pretty good steel, but who knows. (For the record, I'm generally a feel the lock, finesse type of guy. What fun is it to totally bypass the puzzle, right?)

We know the 8077's extremely difficult to manipulate. We know they're obviously not vulnerable to picking, or shimming. The body of the lock itself is quite beefy I'd say, but the shackle continues to poke at my curiosity.

I like my $350-$400 lock just a little too much to attack it with bolt cutters haha. It's all polished up. Figure maybe someone else out there has tried bolt cutting one which didn't have a combo just for the hell of it.

Hi and thanks for your question. The thing to understand is that these locks never claimed to be bolt cutter/crop proof. I'm pretty sure 36 in cutters could snap the shackle very easily. The point, and probably the entire point of the 8077 series is to make entry as obvious as possible to the lock's authorized users or true owner. That nice chrome shell is made to show signs of attack, and we know manipulation is time prohibitive. If someone came back from the weekend and the shackle was cut, then obviously their secrets are no longer that secret, and if someone cut the lock off, took it off site, cut it open figured out the combination, got another 8077, set the combo the same, and put the new one on the file cabinet hoping to trick the real owner, the serial number on the big thick back plate is something that can be checked on a Monday morning to make sure nothing sneaky went on over the weekend.

I think that's the point of most high security padlocks that do not have a shroud. key control, picking times so long that they are not worth being discovered in the act, or so difficult that the learning curve is longer than one has time to learn or deems it worthy of spending the time to learn. Some of these high security locks include physical features which make it easy to identify any attempted or successful breaches in security.

good question, thanks for asking it.
Squelchtone

[Code_Superfly]

Hi and thanks for your question. The thing to understand is that these locks never claimed to be bolt cutter/crop proof. I'm pretty sure 36 in cutters could snap the shackle very easily. The point, and probably the entire point of the 8077 series is to make entry as obvious as possible to the lock's authorized users or true owner. That nice chrome shell is made to show signs of attack, and we know manipulation is time prohibitive. If someone came back from the weekend and the shackle was cut, then obviously their secrets are no longer that secret, and if someone cut the lock off, took it off site, cut it open figured out the combination, got another 8077, set the combo the same, and put the new one on the file cabinet hoping to trick the real owner, the serial number on the big thick back plate is something that can be checked on a Monday morning to make sure nothing sneaky went on over the weekend.

I think that's the point of most high security padlocks that do not have a shroud. key control, picking times so long that they are not worth being discovered in the act, or so difficult that the learning curve is longer than one has time to learn or deems it worthy of spending the time to learn. Some of these high security locks include physical features which make it easy to identify any attempted or successful breaches in security.

good question, thanks for asking it.
Squelchtone

Hey how's it going, Squelchtone? Forum ninja, you reply with the quicknesssss. Props on the 833C by the way. Caught that on youtube. Very nice.

Yeah, I know what you're saying about the 8077. Definitely designed to show any signs of forced entry. Sort of a different approach than say, the S&G Environmental or 833C. (granted parts are numbered on the 833s too, so kind of a combo of strength / intrusion detection there)

I think you're right about 36" cutters most likely not having an issue with the 8077, just wondering if anyone on here has actually tried it. Pretty good idea cutters like those would cut the shackle, but one has to wonder how difficult it would be compared to another shackle of similar diameter. Curious about what type of steel it might be in such an expensive lock. Never know, the 5/16" diameter may surprise everyone hehe.

[unlisted]

Ok, so go and butcher your lock if you really want to..

I think you will be hard pressed to find someone on here who snipped one of those..

[Code_Superfly]

Ok, so go and butcher your lock if you really want to..

I think you will be hard pressed to find someone on here who snipped one of those..

Haha I was afraid of that. Give me ravaged shackles, or give me death!

[raimundo]

these types of locks come with shroud, and without, obviously they are proposed for different applications,

suppose you have some welding tanks locked in a cage and the buildings on fire, you want to move those in an emergency, maybe the 36" single use key is what you can find when no one knows where the key is.

Unshrouded locks also make opportunities for locksmiths who weld to make a shackle shroud to keep that 36 inch pinch off if it.